Saturday, February 11, 2012

LM Havoc, BAE Super AV, Piranha III and MPC contest....quiet before the storm.

Photos courtesy of Mattis via Flickr

Man!  I thought the Canadian TAPV program was operating under the radar.  But compared to the Marine Corps Personnel Carrier competition, the Canadian program is as open to public viewing as the sun is on a cloudless day.

A couple of issues...

1.  A little birdy told me that the revised Request For Proposals was out.  To be precise it came out Tues of this week.
2.  The Iveco Super AV 8x8 (built with BAE) remains a mystery.  I found out that its being developed at the BAE facility in Ontario, CA.  Nothing to be found on either the BAE or Iveco website on this vehicle though.  That's really different from the way that BAE has operated in the past.  They were once the 500 pound gorilla in the room and didn't care who knew what about whatever they were developing.  I take this as an indication of how serious these competitions have become.  Paychecks and jobs are on the line and its no laughing matter.
3.  The Lockheed Martin/Patria Havoc has some fans in the Marine Corps.  The AAV crewmen that got a chance to work up the vehicle in Pendleton are extremely pleased with it.  Full disclosure, I'm a fan of the AMV and the Havoc model seems to build on that success.
4.  Another potential competitor that's missing in action is General Dynamics.  I fully expect them to offer a Piranha model (Stryker lite) but information on what they're working on is also embargoed.  This is the dark horse in the competition in my opinion.  But the Piranha III is in service with the Spanish and Brazilian Marine Corps (just to name two of the customers) and is used in much the same way I see the USMC using it.  Amphibious operations second, troop mobility first.
5.  I still wonder what the game plan is with these vehicles.  Its obvious that they'll probably come into service but does this mean that the Marine Corps has given up on the amphibious tractor?  You just can't beat the mobility that comes with tracks and how do you set up your assault battalions with MPCs?  Correction, more importantly how would they slice out to the MEU's????  Instead of say 40 tracks do you now go out with an even split?  Or do you bias it more to wheels in the desert and tracks in the Pacific?

Regardless, I contacted Paul McCleary (well to be honest I posted a question on his blog about the MPC) and he said...

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Solomon wrote:
ok me out. i've been sitting on the fact that the RFP for the Marine Personnel Carrier program is out (the revised version) and can find no funding information on it.

everyone is closed mouth about it. i asked your guy in Italy for info on the Iveco Super AV 8x8 but he never got back.

can you give me a little visibility on that program and whether or not the Super AV is just vapor ware or not?
2/11/2012 4:11 PM CST

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Paul McLeary wrote:
Shhhh. I actually had a conversation about this recently. More very soon.

So I guess we wait and see. My contacts are exhausted...although I will make another run at the Marine Personnel Carrier program office.



  2. it looks like a hitfist 25 or 30mm mount with a tow launcher but i could easily be wrong.

  3. Here's a question, Sol. Considering all the things the MPC is projected to do and to be, and considering what it looks like it is; can it be considered the replacement and successor to the LAV-25?

  4. i could see it replacing them eventually, but since they just did an upgrade to the LAV-25, it'll probably be at least a decade before we see it happen.


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