This from Reuters...1. This war in Libya shouldn't be a major lift for NATO.2. The UK faced more serious opposition alone in the fight against Argentina.3. The UK shed present day capability for the POSSIBILITY of future savings.4. The Germans practice an almost isolationist foreign policy and an aggressive trade policy.5. The smaller EU nations are punching above their weight but can't be expected to shoulder burdens in two war zones.6. French military power has been greatly over estimated.7. NATO is useless if not dead.
By Erik Kirschbaum and David BrunnstromHow do you best describe the operation in Libya?
BERLIN, April 15 (Reuters) - NATO Secretary-General Anders Fogh Rasmussen and Britain voiced optimism on Friday that NATO allies would supply more combat planes for the Libyan mission, but Italy ruled out ordering its planes to open fire.
Britain and France are urging other NATO allies to provide more planes capable of hitting Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi's ground forces after Washington cut back its role in the operation and passed command onto NATO on March 31. I GUESS TEAM AMERICA WORLD POLICE ISN'T SO USELESS AFTER ALL...ESPECIALLY WHEN ITS A WAR THAT EUROPE WAS BEGGING TO GET INTO. MEANWHILE IN THE US, EVERYONE EXCEPT NEO-CONS AND NO THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE THE US MILITARY, WANTED TO SIT THIS ONE OUT. THIS IS AN ALLIANCE OF LIBERALS AND NEO-CONS THAT I THOUGHT I WOULD NEVER SEE. A POX ON BOTH THEIR HOUSES.
"We have got indications that nations will deliver what is needed ... I'm hopeful that we will get the necessary assets in the very near future," Rasmussen told a news conference at a meeting of NATO foreign ministers in Berlin.
The leaders of France, Britain and the United States published a jointly-written newspaper article on Friday vowing to keep up their military campaign until Gaddafi leaves power. Some countries, such as Russia, say that goes beyond the terms of a U.N. Security Council resolution authorising the campaign.
Libyan rebels have pleaded for more air strikes, saying they face a massacre from government artillery barrages in the besieged city of Misrata.
The United States and European NATO allies have so far rebuffed French and British calls to contribute more actively.
British Foreign Secretary William Hague, who has been lobbying other NATO allies to provide more strike aircraft, also said after talks with U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton that he was hopeful more strike assets would be made available. Asked if Britain might be prepared to contribute more combat aircraft if other allies did not step forward, Hague said: "We'll always keep that under review but ... as of today this question doesn't arise."WTF!!!!! THEY'RE PUSHING THE US TO CONTRIBUTE MORE AIRCRAFT BUT ITS UNDER REVIEW? THE QUESTION DIDN'T ARISE???
One word.
Clusterfuck.
I'll bet China is laughing their asses off.
ReplyDeletewithout a doubt.
ReplyDeletethis is the worst thing that could have happened to the EU in particular and NATO in general.
its been exposed as toothless. worthless and the treaty to not be worth the paper thats written on it.
i see now why the Germans don't mind having US troops on their soil. we're doing defense for them. they don't have to do it for themselves.
Hello Solomon,
ReplyDeleteyou hit the nail on the head there.
To understand what is going on you would need to read the Lisbon Treaty,Common Foreign and Security Policy and the Anglo French defence agreement.
That is a lot of dull reading but it can be summed up as follows:
Eliminate individual European nations' ability to conduct independent military operations by cutting force sizes and eliminating capabilities to enforce military integration.
Hence eliminating British aircraft carriers, there is a European agreement on creating a Pan European carrier group,and maritime patrol aircraft and probably the heavy tank fleet in future.
The idea being that all European countries will work together to project European power overseas.
Sarkozy and arch Europeanist Cameron appear to have seen Libya as a demonstration of European military power.
Hence U.S.S.Enterprise staying in the Arabian Sea and U.S.Air Force operations now drawing down as Obama lets them get on with it.
Good call Mr.President.
Cameron and Sarkozy have been rudely reminded of their military impotence.
The Common Foreign and Security Policy has been shown to be a sham.
Europe is looking a bit silly.
The nited States has reinforced it's global dominance.
GrandLogistics.
wow GL!
ReplyDeletei appreciate your input.
let me ask you this...on another posting here i stated that the British went up against a more formidable foe alone...and here you have a multi-national coalition of the worlds (combined) mightiest nations being fought to a stand still by a backwater country.
this is insane!
Hello Solomon,
ReplyDeleteLibya reminds me of Operation Allied Force,just on a much smaller scale (compare the maps).
Serbia,the mouse that roared*,look what they were up against.
Vast air power resources diluted by the ranges involved in operating from a continental scale spider's web of air bases.
The British contribution to Libya is very similar but without the Harriers and Aircraft carriers.
Back in 1999,the Royal Air Force managed just over 1,000 strike sorties in 78 days,a Harrier squadron claimed over 800 of those.
I have never been able to find out how few the Tornados flew but they were doing the same long range tanker intensive operations they are doing today.
When I first read about them bombing the Balkans from Bruggen,I asked myself,what would they do when the British air bases in Germany closed?
Now I know the answer.
Bombing Libya from Norfolk.
If you look at the maths,the Royal Air Force cannot deploy enough aircraft to provide the British Army with adequate round the clock close air support and air defence when operating from distant land bases.
As the Army has little in the way of air defence systems and is getting rid of it's heavier weapons,that effectively eliminates the United Kingdom's ability to operate independently.
The problem for Cameron and Sarkozy is that the rst of Europe can't provide that capability either.
GrandLogistics.
*A very good old film.
While I do realize that most Americans wanted us to sit this thing out, if I were the Europeans I would be very unhappy with the Obama administration's conduct during the war.
ReplyDeleteHere's why.
When we requested NATO forces be deployed to Afghanistan, we essentially dragged our European partners into a war that wasn't theirs and that the majority of their citizens were oppossed to. Right now, every nation that is dropping ordinance in Libya also has forces commited to Afghanistan.
Consequently, to have the U.S essentially throw in the towel so early in Libya after our European allies took a huge political risk backing us in Afghanistan must be seen by them as a slap in the face. The message being sent here is that America will expect its European allies to assist in America's wars but when the tables are turned America will do nothing.
On a side note, the difficulties being experienced by NATO sans America in Libya should make every member nation rethink its defense budget.
not quite on point Patrick and here's why.
ReplyDeleteAfghanistan was originally the "good war"...the war that everyone was complaining about and the war that no one wanted to fight was the war in Iraq.
also remember that the war in Afghanistan essentially changed...and not for the good.
a couple of years ago it was essentially all Special Forces all the time.
very few conventional forces in theater and everyone was just sending Special Ops guys to the war there.
after the buildup and escalation thats when it become everyones house of cards.
we had a chance to go back to the special ops type thing but Obama over ruled his Vice President and went hard core, Bush style plus up.
still the point remains. this is a limited...low scale fight for the western powers. to see a back water country like this being hold on under the might of airpower is damning on many levels.
Thanks for your assesment on A-stan, It looks right to me. The biggest problem with Libya is that no one seems to be thinking what they should do when (in this case it more looks like if) they conquer Ghadaffi. Or how. I'm sad to see the Swedish Airforce down there, when there isn't any good plan how to win the war. Or the most important thing, how to win the peace.
ReplyDelete