Check out the pic below of the truck that was misidentified as containing the madman, Dorner. The two women are lucky to be alive and the marksmanship skills of the LAPD have to be called into question. Not in the case of bullet placement but in the basic skill of IDENTIFYING your target before you shoot.
Read the story here.
One thing is certain. Dorner is already dead, his body just hasn't stopped moving yet. He will NOT be allowed to surrender (unless he heads to an FBI office) and the Southern California law enforcement agencies are spooked. This will be interesting to watch.
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| Police investigators examine a blue pickup truck riddled with bullets on Redbeam Avenue in Torrance. Officers, thinking shooting suspect Christopher Dorner might have been in the vehicle, unleashed a fusillade, wounding a woman and her mother. (Bob Chamberlin / Los Angeles Times /February 7, 2013) |
Couldn't agree more with the comment about him being dead already. I don't think this one is going to end with life in prison.
ReplyDeleteWhen I read about the two innocents shot up, my first thought, as a LEO, was that someone was going to get in heap big trouble for that. In my state, we have all sorts of laws justifying the use of deadly force, and we are blessed with an Attorney General's office that understands that we need to look at these situations from the officer's point of view when analysing the incident. However, our statutes also clearly state that there is nothing in the law that will justify what constitutes an assault on an innocent bystander. We have to know what we are shooting at. Period.
As far as shot placement, this one looks pretty typical. Most cops, when and if they get in a shoot out, will hit low since they will look over the gun at the target, rather than concentrate on their front sights.
i can understand everything these guys did. i'm not upset about them not (allegedly) giving a warning..this guy has already stated and demonstrated that he will kill LEO's onsight...what i'm not understanding is how they confused vehicle type and didn't determine an two ladies were in the truck instead of a six foot plus two hundred seventy pound black man.
Deleteeverything can be justified EXCEPT for not identifying the targets.
This could get a lot worse.
ReplyDeleteHe's had four years to plan this, and the California wilds are a very large area.
He could have spent the last four years building concealed dug outs, laying down supplies and scouting ambush points.
Things could get very bad
The police have a tendancy to view themselves as invincible.
The reality is half a dozen sharpshooters in a prolonged campaign would wipe the floor with them.
The LAPD has 10,000 LEOs,
Operation impose law saw 90,000 soldiers deployed to Baghdad.
Pistol skills degrade so quickly. What they need to be issued with is a small pistol calibre carbine. Or perhaps both carbine and pistol so police patrolling on their own can transition as the situation allows. One day soon somebody is going to sue a US police department because of one of these shooting incidents.
ReplyDeleteSteve, Sure thing think what these two cops could have done to the two little ladies and their truck with carbines.
ReplyDeleteThe truth is just because they don't wish to take this clown alive doesn't mean they get a pass to shoot any vehicle that might resemble the one they seek nor shoot and injure and kill by standers.
Before these cops shoot a positive ID of target is called for, they aren't in Bagdhad they are in and American city surrounded by people who are innocent of Doners crimes.
The military in the field is expected to do this even fighter pilots in the air must make n ID pass before shooting.
This was just hysterical or a desire to kill over riding common sense.
I wasn't talking 5.56 and TBH I wasn't talking about this situation per se. Fewer shots with better placement will take the perp down quicker and stop "collateral" damage too.
DeleteAs I said pistol skills degrade very quickly. I shoot irregularly yet with a rifle I can't still hit what I want out to 100 yards more or less.
A policeman in a fire fight is in a very different situation than a soldier in a contact. Though many Western politicians would like soldiers to behave like policemen!
Also as my brother said, what does this doner know that makes his death before capture imperative?
ReplyDeleteThere is a reason for it and it's not just because he is one of theirs or has killed a fellow LEO, Doner knows something that some high up officials do not want leaked.
The LEO are willing to kill civilians to shut this man up.
Looks like some LEO's need to re-qualify on the range, or take a Haley course. I understand stress can make you shoot erratically but my God, what terrible shooting.
ReplyDeleteKeep in mind that early reports are that up to seven officers were firing on that vehicle from two to three different locations. Combine this with what Bill has already said and the groupings are somewhat expected, great skills or not.
ReplyDeleteso we also have to add panic or sympathy fire to the equation. not a good showing for LAPD.
DeleteLEO don't stress shoot. They go to range and shoot at paper targets. Why they suck in real shoot outs.
ReplyDeleteMany of my LEO laught that I play paintball. My equipment for paintball mag fed pistol and rifles emulate real steel equipment and I am used returning fire while under pressure. Sure paintballs are not lethal as rounds but at close quarters they are a great training tool as I can see where I got shot and I can replay the scenario when I am eliminated and learn what I did wrong.
Unless they train like they are going to fight they are going to loose everytime.
good point about static range time. but they just don't have the time to do the type of in depth training it would take to become true pistoleers. quite honestly even when it comes to static training i bet i shoot more often than the average LAPD bubba.
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